Natalee Case Discussion #723 2/05/08

[friend of monkeys]

You guys should stay in the Shango thread with me you would have decided this long ago. LOL.......5th suspect...my first choice....my first choice....my first choice!!!!   

Lalas....yes.....funny we  are back where we started.  despite all of the red herrings that CONTINUE TO FLY.    If you are right, yes, we had all of this right the first time.
Since then it has been a massive coverup. 


ARUBA.  Beautiful beaches.  Corrupt to the core.

[klaasend]

hey, Klaas, whats the latest?

Joran in hiding
People in Holland very angry with Joran
People in Aruba very angry with Joran
Joran and attorney may visit police in Holland
Police are searching to locate "Daury"
Mos says no arrest without more evidence

Is that it?

It's my understanding that MOS is still trying to get Joran arrested and Mos is appealing the judges decision.

Some in the NL think it's possible that Lorenzo and Paulus helped Joran dispose of Natalee's body.

[friend of monkeys]

ty caseau for sites....
and welcome

we are not there yet, but we are all a bit closer.

and the ALE's boat is being rocked hard.

much love monkeys.

prayers for Natalee and her family.

Anita and Paulus..u reap what u sow.  Bastards.

[A's Fever]

Aruban Backbreaker

buckeye writes:

Greta: It seems like they got such a runaround, we all got the runaround, assuming that this tape is, I mean as Joe said the tape was something very different than what, and I understand that from his viewpoint as the lawyer but I remember very early on, I mean Jug said within a day or two of Natalee disappearing that the police asked him whether or not Natalee had a history of seizures and according to Jug, and Jug's going to be with us on Wednesday night, he thought that was so bizarre.

Where did the police get that seizure bit if they didn't get it from Joran when they picked him up?

John: I can't imagine any other place, I mean this was right after they had originally interviewed Joran and both Jug and Beth recall at least four (4) investigators asking them whether Natalee had epileptic seizures in the past or any sort of seizure history at all. van der Straaten, Jacobs, Tromp and a female investigator all repeatedly asked both Jug and Beth "does Natalee have any history of this' and they didn't just make that up, they obviously got it from somewhere.

Greta: What are the odds and if it is as we suspect, then frankly they are corrupt.

John: Yeah, they're corrupt if that's true.

___________________________________________________________________

Greta and JQK are corroborating the De Vries tape of joran saying that Natalee suddenly started shaking, with these exchanges from Aruban police investigators over 2 1/2 years ago.

This is a big crack in what has been a brick wall.  At a minimum, this calls for a detailed explanation from Aruban authorities:  why, out of the blue, do they bring up seizures as key subject?

There is simply no other way than for the goon to have told these investigators, nearly exactly what we heard him say to Patrick in car.  And 3 of the 4 are named.

Very bads news for Aruba, and Aruban investigators.  They knew all along: and this is pretty strong evidence that they indeed did know within 48 hours that Natalee was dead.  Which further underscores the words of van der stratten: " I have seen the evidence..."  And yet, 3 days later (+/-), they proceeded with arresting Mickey Johns and Abraham Jones, under suspicion of murdering Natalee Holloway.

With this, a coverup is pretty much confirmed.

.

This is exactly what is needed: the networks' investigative reporters need to go back and look at ALE's actions and statements ,from the beginning, and all the evidence that was collected and then disappeared, all the discrepancies in PV's etc.  If they do this and go public with it, as they have with Joran, this house of cards will crumble.

[Lala'sMom]

I really do think he IS Joran's bro...plus I also think Lorenzo is a drug and arms dealer...who launders money for the really BIG guys.

Do we know where the half brother story got started? As I remember it, posters on here (like Arubagirl) said it was rumored on the island that he was Paulus' son, but at that time there were so many rumors floating around no one knew what to believe. It would be interesting to know if that was a rumor on the island before or after Natalee went missing.

Either way he sounds like a shady guy and someone Joran would have looked up to as a drug/crime presence on the island, so even if if wasn't the half-brother, he could have been involved. I was always intrigued by people's reactions to his name--people on Aruba were adamant that he wasn't involved and would get upset with anyone who dared to suggest he was.

I know where the story got started...it started right here!  On the FP of this place.  That is where the very first posters from Aruba began talking about him.....they talked about him...it's all there. They mentioned it very early in the game here.  I can even tell you who they were.   I know this stuff...you guys are talking my language here...my expertise.

[Spock]

hey, Klaas, whats the latest?

Joran in hiding
People in Holland very angry with Joran
People in Aruba very angry with Joran
Joran and attorney may visit police in Holland
Police are searching to locate "Daury"
Mos says no arrest without more evidence

Is that it?

It's my understanding that MOS is still trying to get Joran arrested and Mos is appealing the judges decision.
Some in the NL think it's possible that Lorenzo and Paulus helped Joran dispose of Natalee's body.

Thanks (as always) for the updates Klaas

[friend of monkeys]

seing lalas a big coffee.  hope the powernap was good sweetie.

[Dayhiker]

A good idea:

Send an email to Greta. Request that she take her camera crew to Aruba, walk up to Lorenzo's house, knock on the door, and ask him for a candid interview about his role in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. Also, ask him for a birth certificate and family tree to confirm and/or deny relationship to the VanderSloots.

This assignment could serve as her redemption...

Is this guy untouchable, a phantom, or a figment of imagination ? It seems as though no one knows or is willing to reveal information about this guy. WTF ??

Good idea!

BTW: I just listened to a long and winded MP3 at Greta's site, a conversation this morning with her reporter Tim Siffles.

To make a long story short, the Prosecutor told Siffles not to expect anything out of them for 8 days. The appeal is going on today in front of three judges.

[BUCKSHOT]

Quick poll...
 
Boat helper:
(1) Koen
(2) Steve Croes
(3) Lorenzo
(4) Paulus
(5) Someone else... Who? ___________

Crime Scene:
(1) Beach
(2) VanderSloot home
(3) Other... Where? ___________

Body Disposal:
(1) Same night.
(2) Following night.
(3) Days later.
(4) Other... When? ___________

[Sue]

Joran basically said it is someone he trusted and he would take to his grave
Who would Joran trust more then his Daddy??

[BlueKYGirl]

I know where the story got started...it started right here!  On the FP of this place.  That is where the very first posters from Aruba began talking about him.....they talked about him...it's all there. They mentioned it very early in the game here.  I can even tell you who they were.   I know this stuff...you guys are talking my language here...my expertise.

Lovely! So was it a rumor on the island before Natalee went missing, or did that story pop up after the fact when Lorenzo's name began to be connected to the case? I thought the rumor was his dad was a successful car dealer on the island who committed suicide and caused Lorenzo to go a little crazy. That's the way I remember it. And then there were the rumors about Paulus and Lorenzo's mother.

I miss the days of the front page codetalkers.

[BUCKSHOT]

Quick poll...
 
Boat helper:
(1) Koen.
(2) Steve Croes.
(3) Lorenzo.
(4) Paulus.
(5) Someone else... Who? ___________

Crime Scene:
(1) Beach.
(2) VanderSloot home.
(3) Other... Where? ___________

Body Disposal:
(1) Same night.
(2) Following night.
(3) Days later.
(4) Other... When? ___________

Disposal Site:
(1) Ocean.
(2) Landfill.
(3) Incinerator.
(4) Other... Where? ___________

[Lala'sMom]

Courtesy of the Shango thread...




Lala'sMom
Scared Monkey
   
Re: SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know?
« Reply #139 on: August 06, 2007, 12:14:55 PM »
   Reply with quote
The early posters, and I do mean within the first week, did not have the inside info that would have them assist in the cover up.  In fact, the ones I read had little to do with the investigation at all. The only person that could possibly be accused of assisting in the cover up would have been Native Lingo.  She was an insider.  The very earliest comments about parties and drugs involved Lorenzo.  That is what I am going by, not saying it's right, just saying that is what I have observed.  I know there are many that think I am way off base here and that Lorenzo had nothing to do with this at all.  I just think we should explore this as a possible scenario.

Lorenzo was known to throw the parties at his houses.
Lorenzo was the drug dealer of choice on the island.
Lorenzo could have some connection to the Sloots.
Lorenzo was kept out of the loop early on.  When his name began to come up in the beginning it was then quickly shushed into oblivion.
Lorenzo, until recently was the mystery man of the hour.

I can't connect the dots because I am too dumb in that regard.  I wish I could, but I can't. However, Tylergal has long contended that what happened to Natalee happened at the HI.  What she says makes sense too.  The alibi of bringing her back to the HI could have been concocted because they knew she could have been seen there. There is a history of some sort with that place.  She was targeted in their casino.  I could go on, but you get the message.  Both scenarios are highly possile.  Now, we have to find the one that is most probable. 

[AZLady]

Hi Monkeys.  How many times have we heard that the most logical explanation is usually the truth?  Isn't this Murphy's Law?  Some examples of logic tells us:

• Joran targeted and drugged Natalee for rape, and he even admitted doing this 20 or more other times
• Locals will not take a girl to the beach for rape.  They will go to a familiar and safe place for perp, ie: his apartment or the equivalent like Lorenzo's.  Beach walking at night is for lovers, not rapists.
• Criminals will not call acquaintances and friends when they need help after a crime has been committed.  They call blood relatives who are assumed to have loyalty.  Joran called PVDS, possibly Lorenzo, if he's a relative.
  

.
It's just simple logic, but it's the most likely scenario.

[Rob]

Quick poll...
 
Boat helper:
(1) Koen
(2) Steve Croes
(3) Lorenzo
(4) Paulus
(5) Someone else... Who? ___________

Crime Scene:
(1) Beach
(2) VanderSloot home
(3) Other... Where? ___________

Body Disposal:
(1) Same night.
(2) Following night.
(3) Days later.
(4) Other... When? ___________

Koen, VDS House, Not sure about the last question, could be 1 or 2.

I know some still lean toward Colonial Custer in the Library with a Monkey wrench. 

[Dayhiker]

Aruban Backbreaker

buckeye writes:

Greta: It seems like they got such a runaround, we all got the runaround, assuming that this tape is, I mean as Joe said the tape was something very different than what, and I understand that from his viewpoint as the lawyer but I remember very early on, I mean Jug said within a day or two of Natalee disappearing that the police asked him whether or not Natalee had a history of seizures and according to Jug, and Jug's going to be with us on Wednesday night, he thought that was so bizarre.

Where did the police get that seizure bit if they didn't get it from Joran when they picked him up?

John: I can't imagine any other place, I mean this was right after they had originally interviewed Joran and both Jug and Beth recall at least four (4) investigators asking them whether Natalee had epileptic seizures in the past or any sort of seizure history at all. van der Straaten, Jacobs, Tromp and a female investigator all repeatedly asked both Jug and Beth "does Natalee have any history of this' and they didn't just make that up, they obviously got it from somewhere.

Greta: What are the odds and if it is as we suspect, then frankly they are corrupt.

John: Yeah, they're corrupt if that's true.

___________________________________________________________________

Greta and JQK are corroborating the De Vries tape of joran saying that Natalee suddenly started shaking, with these exchanges from Aruban police investigators over 2 1/2 years ago.

This is a big crack in what has been a brick wall.  At a minimum, this calls for a detailed explanation from Aruban authorities:  why, out of the blue, do they bring up seizures as key subject?

There is simply no other way than for the goon to have told these investigators, nearly exactly what we heard him say to Patrick in car.  And 3 of the 4 are named.

Very bads news for Aruba, and Aruban investigators.  They knew all along: and this is pretty strong evidence that they indeed did know within 48 hours that Natalee was dead.  Which further underscores the words of van der stratten: " I have seen the evidence..."  And yet, 3 days later (+/-), they proceeded with arresting Mickey Johns and Abraham Jones, under suspicion of murdering Natalee Holloway.

With this, a coverup is pretty much confirmed.

.

I agree Hammer. I posted similar this morning and a couple of things add to your thoughts:


THE ARUBA COVER-UP IS PROVEN. NOW WE KNOW WHAT ARUBA WAS HIDING. NATALEE WAS DRUGGED, RAPED AND MURDERED.


JORAN'S EARLY STATEMENTS ARE MISSING.

Now wonder Joran's early statements are missing. He spoke to the police of Natalee having seizures, pure symptoms of date rape drugs.


NOW WE KNOW WHY AHATA AND ATA HAVE COVERED THIS UP.

AHATA and ATA knew Natalee was drugged and murdered. Van der Straten and Karin Jannsen knew from Joran's first statements Joran drugged and raped her. He said he was only on the case for the first five weeks. That was all it took for him to throw the investigation.


KARIN JANNSEN REFUSED TO TURN JORAN'S EARLY STATEMENTS OVER TO THE SECURITY GUARDS' LAWYER.

Kartin Janssen refused to turn Joran's statements over to the guard's lawyers. She made sure that the security guard's lawyers were given the two Kalpoes' statements by law, but deemed Joran's early statements in her own words "irrelevant."


THE GOVERNMENT, PROSECUTOR AND ALE KNEW NATALEE WAS MURDERED THE SECOND DAY AND COVERED IT UP.

[BlueKYGirl]

A good idea:

Send an email to Greta. Request that she take her camera crew to Aruba, walk up to Lorenzo's house, knock on the door, and ask him for a candid interview about his role in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. Also, ask him for a birth certificate and family tree to confirm and/or deny relationship to the VanderSloots.

This assignment could serve as her redemption...

Is this guy untouchable, a phantom, or a figment of imagination ? It seems as though no one knows or is willing to reveal information about this guy. WTF ??

Good idea!

BTW: I just listened to a long and winded MP3 at Greta's site, a conversation this morning with her reporter Tim Siffles.

To make a long story short, the Prosecutor told Siffles not to expect anything out of them for 8 days. The appeal is going on today in front of three judges.

Isn't it interesting that the only way anyone has gotten answers or come even close to getting justice in this case is not through the legal system, but through the press? A DeVries (or even Van Sustern) expose on Lorenzo would certainly yield more information than years of Aruban "investigation" ever have or ever would.

[Spock]

Devries got the goods on Joran, now if Jossy can do his part on Paulus and Van stratten,

[MumInOhio]

LORENZO



RIJN or GIJN, Lorenzo van   – alleged to be PvdS’s illegitimate son.  Father said to have owned a car dealership before he committed suicide.  Lorenzo is reportedly a reclusive drug dealer, but it is also rumored that he derives his money from his Mother, Astrid.  Lorenzo is allegedly the main source of ecstacy on the island and is nicknamed Xtacy. He resides in Saveneta in a heavily guarded compound complete with concertina wire.  Interviewed by ALE on  6-28-05.





Some early posts regarding Lorenzo:

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1291.0

OK - I am not very good at Shango Tango - But somewhere Shango mentions XTC and DNA - hmmmmm  XTC - Lorenzo and DNA - brothers???

 


Just got back on…reception problems…..Great find Rob……Ms JA……THIS IS WHERE WE NEED TO PEEL BACK THE LAYERS…IT WILL SHOCK THE WORLD!!!!



Probably posted already…pages behind and can’t load pages…I posted this in the Shango thread a while back…

That’s the legal checkmate….they can’t testify against each other…is that why Paulus waived his rights against Joran….go back to Shango…Lala’s

[klaasend]

http://equivocationnation.blogspot.com/

Natalee Holloway Update40: Peter R. De Vries will appear on Larry King, Inside edition. Van der Sloot at undisclosed location. Prosecutors biding time
 
It's all quiet on the Joran front today. No new statements by the parties involved. Except for de Vries' production company, which let everyone know he's reached agreements with Larry King and Inside edition. Oprah is apparently out of the picture.

Joran van der Sloot has said, thorugh his lawyers that he's talking to the police and is fully cooperating this time. They have been appraised of his location. Meanwhile, they're investigating who 'Daury' is and what he did exactly. If he confirms part of van der Sloot's confession, van der Sloot can be arrested in Holland.

The whole thing is dying down again, waiting for a trial. Most of the quality newspapers and state-sponsored TV programs have already used the case a launching pad for complaining about having to compete with commercial stations for the common denominator, due to the government's semi-privitisation initiatives. Or that the police and the prosecutors should have entrapped Joran himself, conveniently forgetting that van der Eem offered his services to the police first.

Van der Eem (34)gave an exclusive interview with de Telegraaf today where he claims to have been disgusted with van der Sloot, and that he hung up on him after van der Sloot called him in tears after the show last Sunday. Van der Eem, a father of two and a businessman, managed to convince Joran that he was a major drugdealer and that he had paid work for van der Sloot.

On last notable bizarre detail is the medical expert Dr. Ernst Stolz claiming that Natalee might have died due to a rare allergy to prostate fluid. It's an extremely rare condition with fewer than six reported cases a year in Europe, but it presents with the symptoms that van der Sloot described.