Lively Case Discussion #529 10/2 - 10/7/2006

[Tylergal]

About CHARLES CROES:  
He seems to be something of a wordsmith/trivia nut....

http://www.aruba.com/msgbrd/read.php?f=1&i=118499&t=118398

(Naturally, if there's an Aruba forum, Sandra's on it...)

Wondering if he could be MERIAN ERNEST?

SIMIAN=ARUBAGIRL?
MERIAN=CHARLES?
SHANGO=US COMIC BOOK WRITER?

Simian=Arubagirl?  Now that'd blow my mind for sure...

I think most of us who were here early on believe that to be the case.

[SunFreak2]

Grande writes attributing to Charles Croes: "...The young man is articulate for his age and intelligent (off the scale)...

Solly, Cholly, the only things off the scale for Joran is his sociopyschopathology and his huge Hermie head.

[sirensong]

Thanks MN! I don't post much, but I read this forum (way too much) because I am outraged by the whole thing.  I am kinda shy and not as good at putting my thoughts into words as you all are!

Thirdstrike and others,  it doesn't really matter what he did or didn'tknow at the time.  It appears he made a choice to have the ATTITUDE he does about all that went on.  As so many pointed out, he thinks nothing of slamming  Natalees family at a time when they are grieving and in need of help, and sings praises of Joran and Aruba.  He keeps whining about how he tried to help them, but in the next breath he complains about all that happened to HIM.  News flash.  It's not about you Charles. In my opinion, he is just making sure he is not going to lose a dime of money he makes in Aruba, by making anyone mad at him.  He probably isgreat friends with many (ATA) involved in this fiasco.  I still wonder if he is related to Steve Croes.

[klaasend]

TO:  Refugees and FOB

1.  The 67 page document you are discussing has absolutely nothing to do with Scared Monkeys.  The document was compiled and distributed by members of Blogs for Natalee.

2.  I don't know what Dave meant when he was interviewed on the Dana Pretzer show but I doubt it had anything to do with the 67 page document.

3.  Joran was 17 and Rika was 12 in March 2005.  Rika was still in Middle School (no higher than 8th grade) as of the 2005-2006 year.  6th grade (11-12yr), 7th grade (12-13yr), 8th grade (13-14yr).  This would mean that Rika had to be 12 in March 2005.

From the International School of Aruba website:

[mrs. red]

About CHARLES CROES:  
He seems to be something of a wordsmith/trivia nut....

http://www.aruba.com/msgbrd/read.php?f=1&i=118499&t=118398

(Naturally, if there's an Aruba forum, Sandra's on it...)

Wondering if he could be MERIAN ERNEST?

SIMIAN=ARUBAGIRL?
MERIAN=CHARLES?
SHANGO=US COMIC BOOK WRITER?

Simian=Arubagirl?  Now that'd blow my mind for sure...

I think most of us who were here early on believe that to be the case.

Hey Y'all I have not read back yet, but I have heard for a long time that AG was Simian...

[klaasend]

Sorry, I really do not believe that AG was Simian.

[Anna]

The Propaganda Continues...

Grande writes attributing to Charles Croes: "...The young man is articulate for his age and intelligent (off the scale)...."

Indeed.  And his (jvds) hobby is "criminal law."  Right.  At 17 yrs old, with the pictorial evidence and self-admissions of all nite carousing, gambling, drinking.

If the sporter was "off the scale intelligent" and a diligent student of "criminal law" we should have seen some academic verifications of same.  Perhaps admission to a university of note, a Harvard, a Stanford.  Or maybe Amherst, or Duke.

[snipped for brevity]
.

HAMMER

Well, no one is saying off which end of the chart!!  I vote for the bottom, yuk, yuk, yuk!  

I have worked with gifted children in volunteer program some time ago getting our schools accredited in that area and I don't see it.  He can't even keep his own lies straight talking to Greta.

I recall hearing someone say long ago, must have been Julia, that they were having a difficult time interrogating Joran because he was smarter than the police.  Heaven help them if that's the case.

I think this is a rumor Anita and Julia and Joran's fans like to circulate but as you say, he has nothing to show for it and it is only evidenced by their word for it.  He got a 1 out of a possible 5 on the single AP test he took and one would do better than that by marking the "C" box every time.  

The year my oldest went to Georgetown, there was a kid from Huntsville, AL, who had over a hundred college credit hours from taking AP tests.       Well, we had three  subjects for nine hours, lol!     And we thought we were something until they were posted and we saw what others had.   Very humbling I must say.  That kid from Huntsville aced subjects he never took in high school like anything and I think that is common among very bright kids, not flunking the one they have been studying as had Aruba's Brain Trust.  

Might not a better word for Joran be precocious as meaning prematurely developed in the area of his warped criminal/predatory intent?  More like old in this regard before his time, advanced beyond his years but not particularly clever at it.  After all, we have all been on to him from the moment Beth said his name.  This would make him more the equivalent of a very mediocre aging pervert.  Hum. . .sort of like his father perhaps?

Wouldn't even the most modest of criminals know never to be the last one seen with a victim?  That's pretty basic.  

Just guessing. . . . . . .


.

[AZLady]

Hi Monkeys.  I'm avoiding grading papers, again.  Hanging out here instead.  I don't know if AG was Simian or not.  I do think Simian was on Aruba and on the peripheral edges of the case.  On the other hand, AG seems to want to write continuously about this case and other things; Simian has not surfaced or written in quite some time.  If AG was Simian, for some reason she abandoned the identity but has not stopped writing about the case.

[AZLady]

Anna, you are so right.  I am a teacher and the parent of a gifted child.  The term is used much too loosely, in my opinion.  A gifted child exhibits achievement beyond his/her peers in at least one area.  Here is a link to the organization that defines "gifted" in children.  http://www.nagc.org/index.aspx?id=574

If you read any of the definitions, you will realize that while Joran is bright and capable, albeit lazy and unmotivated, he is not gifted.  Gifted children achieve remarkable accomplishments at very early ages.  Joran has not achieved academic excellence, athletic excellence, or any other type of excellence.  He's capable and may be quite intelligent, but he is not gifted.

[Anna]

.
Not being much of a fan of the Marvel characters, I do have a question in that regard.  Must leave for a while but will be back to see if anyone knows the answer to this question.  I don't and am sincerely asking for I have forgotten.  I knew it at one time but it doesn't come back to me for some reason.

Which one of the casinos, online or otherwise, has a Marvel comic theme?  There is one and I was just thinking that maybe this was a source for some of those posters.  Maybe instead of being a member of ALE, some of them were casino workers who heard things?  But I cannot for the life of me remember which casino has the Marvel characters.

BBLater, monkeys.

 

[Grande]

About CHARLES CROES:  
He seems to be something of a wordsmith/trivia nut....

http://www.aruba.com/msgbrd/read.php?f=1&i=118499&t=118398

(Naturally, if there's an Aruba forum, Sandra's on it...)

Wondering if he could be MERIAN ERNEST?

SIMIAN=ARUBAGIRL?
MERIAN=CHARLES?
SHANGO=US COMIC BOOK WRITER?

BINGO, I have been waiting for someone to catch that.  Look at his comments again with that in mind.  JMO.  Remember it was Sandra that initially claimed to be Shango.

[Grande]

Sorry, I really do not believe that AG was Simian.

I agree Klaas

[yapperz1]

FWIW I don not believe arubagirl was the original Simian. She may well have been the doppleganger.

[lowsw]

Supposedly there was another girl that went missing in Aruba in Mar 2006.  Her name was Lucila Dirksz.

Here is the link to the Solodipueblo article on the missing girl.  Article is first one on Page 3.
 
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:XV8WOiM4go8J:www.solodipueblo.com/index.php%3Foption%3Dcom_docman%26task%3Ddoc_download%26gid%3D367%26Itemid%3D2+%22benita+valdez%22+aruba&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1&ie=UTF-8

If anyone can translate, it would be interesting to see what was said and if it mentions whether the Aruban LE/police have done anything to help the family.

[SunFreak2]

.


Which one of the casinos, online or otherwise, has a Marvel comic theme?  There is one and I was just thinking that maybe this was a source for some of those posters.  

 

This is a list and description of the land casinos.

Aruba's 11 casinos open between 10 am and noon for slot-machine play, and late in the afternoon or early in the evening for game-table play. While dress is casual, most people wear resort-casual closing to the casinos; swimsuits, short shorts, and beach shoes are out of place.

The Crystal Casino, across from the waterfront in Oranjestad, is open 24 hours a day, every day of the week. It's lavishly decorated with marble, brass, and gold leaf, all lighted by dripping-crystal chandeliers. Live entertainment is featured in the main room each evening, and a long-running Latin dance-and-music show is featured in the adjoining Crystal Theatre.

The only casino actually on the waterfront is the Seaport Casino, which is about half the size of the Crystal and located across L.G. Smith Blvd at the Seaport Marketplace. It's a more casual place, with the usual table and slot machines, plus bingo games on Tuesdays and Sundays. Live entertainment is featured Friday and Saturday nights.

The Alhambra Casino and Aladdin Theatre, on Manchebo Beach in the low-rise resort area, is probably the most popular entertainment center on the island. The doorman, dressed as a genie, will shake your hand as you enter and welcome you to his world of Moorish fantasy. Inside, you'll find several bars and a restaurant, as well as more than 300 slot machines and the usual gaming tables. The theater features various acts, including singers, dancers, and impersonators. Shops out back are open until midnight, but the casino doesn't close until about 3 am.

The largest casino on the island is Royal Cabana at La Cabana Beach Resort in the low-rise hotel area. Its Tropicana Showroom has 600 seats and features a popular female impersonator show. The huge casino has the usual slots (more than 300) and gaming tables (more than 30), plus jewelry, cigar, and souvenir shops.

In the high-rise hotel district, all the big resorts have a casino. The Wyndham's Casablanca has a bar and live music. Big-buck gamblers gather in the back and the Cabaret Royal Showroom features a review from Havana. Copacabana at the Hyatt has an impressive Rio theme. Stop in just to look around and put a few coins in the slots, even if you're not a gambler. A live band provides music every evening. The Excelsior at the Holiday Inn draws a crowd on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays for 3:30 pm bingo games.

Live music sets a jovial mood at Marriott's Stellaris. You can play the nickel slots or move up to high-rolling craps and blackjack. The Royal Palm at the Allegro hums with the sounds of roulette, Caribbean stud poker, and baccarat, but the pulse quickens nightly when the 10:30 bingo games begin. Many of the Allegro staff are also talented performers who put on various Vegas-quality presentations on the jumbo stage at Las Palmas Showroom.

Things are a bit quieter at the casual Marengue in the Aruba Grand Resort, but you'll still find some action at the slots and game tables until around 2 am. Masquerade at the Radisson, has a popular big-screen TV that shows sports events in the bar. You'll find plenty of company there when a big game is being played. Those who aren't interested in sports can enjoy the tables and slots in the large domed playing area.

http://www.arubatravelinfo.com/casino.html

[klaasend]

lowsw - I think I remember that this girl did turn up.  There was a young male that went missing as well this year.  His family was really angry because ALE wouldn't help them.

[Grande]

There are similarities between Charles' writings and Shango's.  There in lies my motive for posting that dialogue.  It was not meant to offend anyone including Charles himself.  I have nothing against Charles, everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I respect that.  

I think the most effective thing would be to analyze what was said with regards to this case and dismiss the opinions that are offered.  Everyone knows what they say about opinions, they are similar to azzholes in that everyone has one.

Respect,
Grande

[mrs. red]

FWIW I don not believe arubagirl was the original Simian. She may well have been the doppleganger.

Oh... that's a very good point...

[Kat_Gram]

The way that Mr. Croes talks ( or writes ) is similar to Shango's in that:
a.) there are alot of words
b.) after you read it, you have no idea what either one said.

[mrs. red]

Keep the faith Monkeys...
it does move mountains!!