Natalee Case Discussion #679 8/26 - 8/31/2007

[KarmaRoundUp]

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_33831.php

Hi Monkeys
Klaas,this is truly beautiful.

[KarmaRoundUp]

  Truthseeker2 Reading back, I've been looking for a statement Nadira made in which she said Satish hardly ever or never went out with Deepak. That same satatement said he was pacing about, excited, waiting for Deepak to come home.  This contradicted everything else we were told about him picking Deepak up from work that night.
   According to Sander's 6/16 PV he has known the Kalpoes a year and a half, and Koen goes to the movies with them.  Andre Santos PV says he has known Joran 6 years, Satish 2 and Deepak 1 year.
    I've been comparing the Kapoes' 5/31 PVs and until we get to the security guards their stories don't match. Their account of the guards is practically word for word, but details at C&C's totally different.  Deepak's account matches Joran's 6/9 PV, the first we have seen from him. Within 48 hours the brothers' stories don't match. Why?  Is it at all possible that Satish wasn't with Joran and Satish that night?
     

I don't think there is any doubt that Satish was with them on the night of 05/29 and early morning of 05/30.  But...trying to keep an open mind...could it have actually been Freddie that was with them instead of Satish and that is why Deepak has been so protective of Satish?  Freddie wasn't id'd so Satish was the one picked up.  ??????

I have seen a few discrepancies in the early stories based on the PV's, such as the one where Deepak says that Satish drove to CnC's and Deepak left the bar looking for J&S but did not find them at the car.  Deepak then says he sat down at the rear of the car and mis-called Satish.  Satish then comes out and gives Deepak the keys and returns to CnC's to get Joran.  This was only told one time.  Every other time it appears Deepak drives them to CnC's.  Is it significant?  I don't know.  Maybe.

Joran supposedly was surprised to see that Deepak brought Satish with him that night.Also,The gardener witness only ID'd Joran and Deepak sitting in the front seat of the Kalpoe car by the pond....if I recall correctly.

[KarmaRoundUp]

From Joran's June 9, 2005 statement:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=160.0

On Sunday, I do not remember the date any more, I went at approximately 16.00 hours, to the "Excelsior Casino" at the Holiday Inn Hotel to play "Texas Hold'm poker". (with this the suspect is talking about May 29th 2005). I went with my father named "Paul van der SLOOT" to the casino. I went to play "Texas Hold'm Poker" with my father. It is a poker game in which you get 7 cards and you have to make a card combination with your best (5) cards. You get 500 U.S. $ of fake money and with this money you play. I was done sooner than my father and I went and hung around in the casino. When it was half time of the game my father wanted to go home to go and babysit my ten year old brother. At my father's request I sat in for him and played "Texas Hold'm poker. I am not sure as to when half time was but I think it was between 19.00 and 20.00 hours. I kept on gambling until I lost too. This was according to me until 21.30 to 22.00 hours. I went to walk around in the casino and after that went to the "Blackjack" table to play blackjack. While I was sitting at the table the girl "Natalee" that is missing now to the blackjack table together with her friends. When the English speaking girls came to the blackjack table they introduced themselves. I do not remember the names of the girls anymore but they were from the same group of students that Natalee belonged to. According to me the friends of Natalee played blackjack but Natalee didn't. A girl that was sitting at my left side on the table asked me in English if I could help her play blackjack because she had lost U.S. $ 360,= of her father's money. The girl bet U.S. $ 20,= in the game and I helped her win U.S. $ 100,= with it. After the girl had won U.S. $ 100,= I advised her to call it quits but she wanted to continue. I told her again that she should stop and her friends also said that she should stop. Probably the girl after that went to cash in her chips for money. The girlfriends of the girl asked me if I was going to "Carlos & Charlies" that night. I told them that I couldn't do that because I had school tomorrow. The girls kept insisting that I should meet them at "Carlos & Charlies" because it was their last night on Aruba. After they kept insisting I agreed to meet with at "Carlos & Charlies".

From Jaime's June 17, 2005 statement:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=197.0

On May 29th 2005, between the hours of 16.00 and 19.00, I was called by Joran on my mobile phone with the phone number "xxxxxxx". Sometimes Joran calls me on the mobile phone of my sister, her name is "Maria del Pilar CARRASQUIXIA CACERES". Her calling name is "Pilar". The mobile phone number of Pilar is "xxxxxxx". The mobile phone number of Joran is "xxxxxxx". Joran had asked me whether I wanted to go out with him that night. He told me that a few American girls would go to "Carlos & Charlies" and whether I wanted to meet up with him there. According to me I had said to Joran that I would let him know later that day whether or not I would go out with him that night. I had also said to Joran that I had to work the next day. According to me I was phoned later that day by Joran again but I hadn't answered my mobile phone. Because it is the vacation now I temporarily work in "Caribbean Overseas". I work in the big Poolkasten. On May 29th 2005 I stayed home and slept. I went to bed at approximately 22.00 hours.



So Joran claims he was asked to go to CnC by the MB kids sometime after 22:00.  Jaimie claims Joran called him between 16:00 and 19:00 and told him about the American girls and CnC.

Which is it?

What it is is part of a pimps plans to go to C&C's long before any MB kids"begged"him to go.IMO Natalee was targeted.

[KarmaRoundUp]

If Satish wasn't there, and it was Freddy instead, I would think the object would be to protect Freddy.

Later, I can hypothesize that Deepak would be protective of Satish, because it would be easy to trip him up.

Why would Deepak go along with Joran on keeping Freddy totally out? Perhaps Freddy threatened to tell what Joran did to Natalee if he became involved, and Deepak went along because Deepak was also involved?

Well. to put Freddie with Joran that night you would need to leave out a Kalpoe.  Who says it has to be Satish?  Maybe Satish used Deepak's car????

Just playing around with this whole concept of Freddie versus one of the Kalpose....will have to give it some more thought.

Could have been both Freddy and Satish at C&C's.Joran targeted Natalee,Satish was with Deepak and Joran in the beginning of their night,Freddy just shows up at C&C's possible with a few other pimps.Satish could have been dropped off at home before their pimp game began and Freddy(and possible a few other pimps)had their sick fun with Natalee.Dropping Satish off at home before their sick games began could also be a way for Deepak to protect his brother.

[AZSunny]

Could have been both Freddy and Satish at C&C's.Joran targeted Natalee,Satish was with Deepak and Joran in the beginning of their night,Freddy just shows up at C&C's possible with a few other pimps.Satish could have been dropped off at home before their pimp game began and Freddy(and possible a few other pimps)had their sick fun with Natalee.Dropping Satish off at home before their sick games began could also be a way for Deepak to protect his brother.
[/quote]

Wasn't there something about Deepak and Satish going to talk to "some friends" at C and C's?  could those friends have been Freddy and other pimps? One of them said they were talking to friends, and when he turned around he couldn't find the others and went out to the car.  I think that was Deepak.

[ala_gunslinger]

From Joran's June 9, 2005 statement:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=160.0

On Sunday, I do not remember the date any more, I went at approximately 16.00 hours, to the "Excelsior Casino" at the Holiday Inn Hotel to play "Texas Hold'm poker". (with this the suspect is talking about May 29th 2005). I went with my father named "Paul van der SLOOT" to the casino. I went to play "Texas Hold'm Poker" with my father. It is a poker game in which you get 7 cards and you have to make a card combination with your best (5) cards. You get 500 U.S. $ of fake money and with this money you play. I was done sooner than my father and I went and hung around in the casino. When it was half time of the game my father wanted to go home to go and babysit my ten year old brother. At my father's request I sat in for him and played "Texas Hold'm poker. I am not sure as to when half time was but I think it was between 19.00 and 20.00 hours. I kept on gambling until I lost too. This was according to me until 21.30 to 22.00 hours. I went to walk around in the casino and after that went to the "Blackjack" table to play blackjack. While I was sitting at the table the girl "Natalee" that is missing now to the blackjack table together with her friends. When the English speaking girls came to the blackjack table they introduced themselves. I do not remember the names of the girls anymore but they were from the same group of students that Natalee belonged to. According to me the friends of Natalee played blackjack but Natalee didn't. A girl that was sitting at my left side on the table asked me in English if I could help her play blackjack because she had lost U.S. $ 360,= of her father's money. The girl bet U.S. $ 20,= in the game and I helped her win U.S. $ 100,= with it. After the girl had won U.S. $ 100,= I advised her to call it quits but she wanted to continue. I told her again that she should stop and her friends also said that she should stop. Probably the girl after that went to cash in her chips for money. The girlfriends of the girl asked me if I was going to "Carlos & Charlies" that night. I told them that I couldn't do that because I had school tomorrow. The girls kept insisting that I should meet them at "Carlos & Charlies" because it was their last night on Aruba. After they kept insisting I agreed to meet with at "Carlos & Charlies".

From Jaime's June 17, 2005 statement:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=197.0

On May 29th 2005, between the hours of 16.00 and 19.00, I was called by Joran on my mobile phone with the phone number "xxxxxxx". Sometimes Joran calls me on the mobile phone of my sister, her name is "Maria del Pilar CARRASQUIXIA CACERES". Her calling name is "Pilar". The mobile phone number of Pilar is "xxxxxxx". The mobile phone number of Joran is "xxxxxxx". Joran had asked me whether I wanted to go out with him that night. He told me that a few American girls would go to "Carlos & Charlies" and whether I wanted to meet up with him there. According to me I had said to Joran that I would let him know later that day whether or not I would go out with him that night. I had also said to Joran that I had to work the next day. According to me I was phoned later that day by Joran again but I hadn't answered my mobile phone. Because it is the vacation now I temporarily work in "Caribbean Overseas". I work in the big Poolkasten. On May 29th 2005 I stayed home and slept. I went to bed at approximately 22.00 hours.



So Joran claims he was asked to go to CnC by the MB kids sometime after 22:00.  Jaimie claims Joran called him between 16:00 and 19:00 and told him about the American girls and CnC.

Which is it?

What it is is part of a pimps plans to go to C&C's long before any MB kids"begged"him to go.IMO Natalee was targeted.

In other words, they were not invited by anyone.

[ala_gunslinger]

If Satish wasn't there, and it was Freddy instead, I would think the object would be to protect Freddy.

Later, I can hypothesize that Deepak would be protective of Satish, because it would be easy to trip him up.

Why would Deepak go along with Joran on keeping Freddy totally out? Perhaps Freddy threatened to tell what Joran did to Natalee if he became involved, and Deepak went along because Deepak was also involved?

Well. to put Freddie with Joran that night you would need to leave out a Kalpoe.  Who says it has to be Satish?  Maybe Satish used Deepak's car????

Just playing around with this whole concept of Freddie versus one of the Kalpose....will have to give it some more thought.

Could have been both Freddy and Satish at C&C's.Joran targeted Natalee,Satish was with Deepak and Joran in the beginning of their night,Freddy just shows up at C&C's possible with a few other pimps.Satish could have been dropped off at home before their pimp game began and Freddy(and possible a few other pimps)had their sick fun with Natalee.Dropping Satish off at home before their sick games began could also be a way for Deepak to protect his brother.

Because freddy knows what paulus did.  jvds had to pass because she was a Virgin.

[Helen Back]

That's what I don't get, how can a smart man have the utmost confidence in the 2 main players that have so utterly and completely failed Natalee, her family, Aruba and themselves?

The $64,000 question, Frank, is "Who was pushing their buttons?" Who were these Nazis goose stepping to?

I agree.  These two moved ahead with arresting the SG's even though they knew J2K had lied right out of the gate.  No forensics, perps running loose.  Even while J2k were detained, Janssen knew the "interrogations" were baloney and did nothing to insist on decent lines of questioning while they were in custody.  It was all for show.  I bet her arguments before the judges in the "closed" hearings were as limp as spaghetti.  By that time, everyone was turning on Beth, and attack the victim was the new strategy.  Who was calling the shots?

IMO Paulus was involved from the beginning and Natalee was singled out.  I have wondered every day what Paulus' involvement could have been?  My best guess is he has some really smarmy associates.  He's had some favors done for him, and he has done some favors for others.  There is a reason why he was booted out as a judge, and I bet it's all connected.

[klaasend]

From Deepak's June 9th statement:
A friend of mine came walking up to me. His name is Eli and I don't know his last name. He used to me in my class at the MAVO/BAVO. Eli talked to me for about five to ten minutes. Eli then walked away. When I turned around Satish and Joran were nowhere to be seen. They hadn't even told that they were leaving. I looked for them for a short while, but hadn't found them. I was in the bathroom for a little while. I have no patience to look. After the bathroom I looked around somewhat. I walked past the bar, past the glass section where the "Carlos & Charlies" souvenirs of "Carlos & Charlie" are sold to the outside. When I was walking outside, I could hear the announcement that it was the last opportunity to buy alcohol. That is always announced before closing, I walked to my car. My car was the only one parked in the back of the parking lot. I went and sat in my car to wait for Satish and Joran. I had no more money left on my pre-paid phone to call them.

FYI - Deepak's June 9th statement is worth disecting again, IMO
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=213.0

[klaasend]

From Deepak's June 9th statement:

It wasn't the first time that I had girls in my car that were on vacation and dropped them off at hotels. I looked in front of me and asked Joran in Papiamentu what were we going to do. Joran answered in Papiamentu drive around. I backed up my car, drove from the parking lot and then past "Carlos & Charlies" twice. I had the volume of my car radio turned up pretty high. To understand each other we had to talk loudly. During the two times that we drove past "Carlos & Charlies" I hadn't spoken to the girl. I only talked to my brother. When I was going to pass by Carlos & Charlies for the third time I saw a police van on the corner. I wasn't wearing my seatbelt and because of that I turned into the other direction. I decided to Turn right instead of left, in the direction of   "Choose a Name". When I turned left we had to drive at walking pace because of a row of cars in front of me. During that time the girl stuck her head out of the car and yelled something. I had not understood what she had shouted. I looked into the direction she had been yelling to. I saw a group of people standing there, there were both boys and girls there. It was a group of more than ten people. I assumed that they belonged with her group. One of the boys responded and walked towards us. I hear the boy say: " What are you doing there. Are you crazy, get out of the car."(loosely translated: What are you doing. Are you nuts/crazy. Get out of that car). She didn't want to get out. I hadn't responded to it. I kept on driving at walking pace and stopped my car at the zebra crossing. I had done this because I thought it would be better if she went with her friends. To prevent problems because her friends clearly didn't want her coming with us. To your question as to what I mean by problems, I can state the following. The kind of problem that I have now gotten into. People would think that she would have gone with us against her will. She had been more drunk than she had been previously. I thought that she talked too much. She talked pretty loud, I could not hear what she was talking about. I had told her in English that if her friends thought it better she'd go with them, that it would be best if she did. She refused to go with them. She said I could also drop her off, seeing as I owned a car

[klaasend]

From Deepak's June 9th statement:

According to me Joran said to her that we were at the hotel. She got out. I had not seen this. I heard something fall. I heard Joran say in Papiamentu shit she has fallen down. Joran exited through the same car door as where she had fallen down to help her up. That was the right back door. I had seen the girl on the ground. I saw Joran help her. I saw that the girl turned around and pushed Joran into the car. I heard that she said something to Joran. I was unable to hear what she had said to Joran. The car radio had been turned down somewhat, the volume was maybe at the nine level or something like that. Joran looked surprised. She walked away from Joran. What I saw is that she was walking towards the lobby. I did not see her enter the lobby. I saw that she leaned against a pillar with one hand. Joran had gotten back into the car and was sitting behind Satish. In the lobby I saw a man walking up to the girl. I saw that he had a radio in his left hand. I assumed that he was talking into the radio because he held it closely in front of his mouth. It was a dark coloured man. He was fairly tall. He wore a black T-shirt and black pants.

[dennisintn]

ROFLMOA Kermit! Come to think of it we don't have pictures of them at the same at the same time bar in Aruba. Hmmmmm.

how old is this guy?  he looks 45 yrs. old.
dennisintn

[igsigs]

Driving away...

Deepak 6/9 makes it seem like he knew something bad was going to happen. He was worried about this...and scared about that...driving in circles...avoiding the visibility team.

What's with all the concern? The feeling of guilt...beforehand...

[klaasend]

Dennis - he's in his late 20's

[IndyDan]

The supposedly secretly taped conversation amongst the JK2 while in police custody where Deepak says "your own father - unbelievable" indicates to me that Paulus was involved in the gang rape.  And that fits into Janet's theory of how this all went down.  After they all abused Natalee, they left to dump her on the beach but along the way she died.  Paulus simply went to bed afterwards.
That's why it wasn't so difficult to call PVDS to help with strategy on what to do, after all he was party to rape. 
If PVDS was just involved in the coverup, Deepak doesn't say "your own father - unbelievable".  Paulus had to parttake in the perversion of the original crime to cause Deepak to make that statement.

[klaasend]

Driving away...

Deepak 6/9 makes it seem like he knew something bad was going to happen. He was worried about this...and scared about that...driving in circles...avoiding the visibility team.

What's with all the concern? The feeling of guilt...beforehand...

I don't know about feeling of guilt before hand because we know his entire June 9th statement is FOS.  BUT...it does appear some guilt was showing through all the lies.

[klaasend]

The supposedly secretly taped conversation amongst the JK2 while in police custody where Deepak says "your own father - unbelievable" indicates to me that Paulus was involved in the gang rape.  And that fits into Janet's theory of how this all went down.  After they all abused Natalee, they left to dump her on the beach but along the way she died.  Paulus simply went to bed afterwards.
That's why it wasn't so difficult to call PVDS to help with strategy on what to do, after all he was party to rape. 
If PVDS was just involved in the coverup, Deepak doesn't say "your own father - unbelievable".  Paulus had to parttake in the perversion of the original crime to cause Deepak to make that statement.

Sickening as it sounds it sure appears that way.

[dennisintn]

Dennis - he's in his late 20's

he looks like he spends a lot of time dipping into his own product line.
dennisintn

[Observer]

Such a crock of $?@! 27 months later and still they havent been honest what these punks were doing that night!!They get to the bar at 12:30AM and 15 minutes later Deepak is already outside as he doesnt have a drink,doesnt dance and all he does is talk to a friend for 5-10 minutes and goes to the bathroom.

His whole purpose of going to C&C was what?? Picking up and driving Joran to the bar so he could have a drink?? He lost patience looking for his Brother and Joran..Yeh right!! We have all seen the bar and it isnt all that big..It was all premeditated and his whole job was to have that car ready as the drugged drink was administered by last call. The plan was already set in motion as Joran played himself off as a exchange student from holland staying at there same hotel. Get her in the car and let the pimp games begin.

[robots]

From Deepak's June 9th statement:

According to me Joran said to her that we were at the hotel. She got out. I had not seen this. I heard something fall. I heard Joran say in Papiamentu shit she has fallen down. Joran exited through the same car door as where she had fallen down to help her up. That was the right back door. I had seen the girl on the ground. I saw Joran help her. I saw that the girl turned around and pushed Joran into the car. I heard that she said something to Joran. I was unable to hear what she had said to Joran. The car radio had been turned down somewhat, the volume was maybe at the nine level or something like that. Joran looked surprised. She walked away from Joran. What I saw is that she was walking towards the lobby. I did not see her enter the lobby. I saw that she leaned against a pillar with one hand. Joran had gotten back into the car and was sitting behind Satish. In the lobby I saw a man walking up to the girl. I saw that he had a radio in his left hand. I assumed that he was talking into the radio because he held it closely in front of his mouth. It was a dark coloured man. He was fairly tall. He wore a black T-shirt and black pants.

it is ALL a LIE