Lively Case Discussion #550 11/28 - 11/29/2006

[San]

Posted by All10Suspects at RU:

http://tinyurl.com/tef95


(snipped)
Also Friday, the court barred van der Sloot's lawyer, Antonio Carlo, from visiting the teen, effectively removing him from the case, said Attorney General spokeswoman Mariaine Croes.

As a result, the van der Sloots retained two more attorneys for the defense of their son, Richie Kock and Arjan Debie.

The court granted prosecutors' request to remove Carlo because he had visited one of two former security guards who had been detained and released in the case, authorities said.

Croes said the Dutch teenager has a team of lawyers, so Carlo's removal will not leave van der Sloot without representation. The spokeswoman is not related to Steve Croes.

Carlo did not return calls seeking comment.

So Antonio Carlo was removed from the case around June 17, 2005.
Was this after is meeting with KJ? Could this mean he really did have
a meeting with KJ saying Joran had something to to with KJ?

Does anyone else besides me think this is a lame excuse for KJ to remove Carlo as Joran's attorney?

The court granted prosecutors' request to remove Carlo because he had visited one of two former security guards who had been detained and released in the case, authorities said.

Yes I do think it is an excuse to remove Carlo.  A year and a half later we are still find out all their lies.

Karin Janssen is corrupt as they come and I believe she is Paulus' mistress.

[Ono]

I had known about Antonio Carlo's being removed from the case. It never made sense that it was done because he apparently visited one of the security guards......but if he had met with KJ, and "cleared his conscience"., as Mr. DeVries stated........now that might make sense.....
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

http://tinyurl.com/tef95

Also Friday, the court barred van der Sloot's lawyer, Antonio Carlo, from visiting the teen, effectively removing him from the case, said Attorney General spokeswoman Mariaine Croes.

As a result, the van der Sloots retained two more attorneys for the defense of their son, Richie Kock and Arjan Debie.

The court granted prosecutors' request to remove Carlo because he had visited one of two former security guards who had been detained and released in the case, authorities said.

Croes said the Dutch teenager has a team of lawyers, so Carlo's removal will not leave van der Sloot without representation. The spokeswoman is not related to Steve Croes.

Carlo did not return calls seeking comment.

I remember vividly how Antonio Carlo re-acted so curiously defensive when an American reporter caught up with him early on in this case and asked him if he was still Joran's attorney...

[Ono]

Well, Anna, we are quick to forget that being American means we could be from anywhere.  Yes, I have those half-Dutch children, but when they are bad, I know they are much Dutch than Brit!  I tell them that, too.       I say, "You are just like your daddy."  I never call him "Tater Head" to his face, however.

  I have quarter-Dutch children but stress their maternal Scottish & Brit genes.   Actally, "Tater-Head" aptly describes former mother-in-law.

I think one of the biggest problems facing this country now and even more in the future is all the people who are born and raised here but still think of themselves as being from another country.

Irag and several countries around the world are fighting and dividing over 'sectarian/ethinic' lines.

I can see the same occuring here and causing much pain and division.

Carnut: Studying & learning one's genealogical historical heritage is a good thing.

[blah]

I had known about Antonio Carlo's being removed from the case. It never made sense that it was done because he apparently visited one of the security guards......but if he had met with KJ, and "cleared his conscience"., as Mr. DeVries stated........now that might make sense.....
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

http://tinyurl.com/tef95

Also Friday, the court barred van der Sloot's lawyer, Antonio Carlo, from visiting the teen, effectively removing him from the case, said Attorney General spokeswoman Mariaine Croes.

As a result, the van der Sloots retained two more attorneys for the defense of their son, Richie Kock and Arjan Debie.

The court granted prosecutors' request to remove Carlo because he had visited one of two former security guards who had been detained and released in the case, authorities said.

Croes said the Dutch teenager has a team of lawyers, so Carlo's removal will not leave van der Sloot without representation. The spokeswoman is not related to Steve Croes.

Carlo did not return calls seeking comment.

I remember vividly how Antonio Carlo re-acted so curiously defensive when an American reporter caught up with him early on in this case and asked him if he was still Joran's attorney...

Carlo seems to be a weak link and it is clear that he knows exactly what happened to Natalee.  Maybe some pressure on this guy will make him spill the beans.  I wonder what the Ducth investigators, or DeVries can do to turn up some heat on this guy.

[Ono]

if you were born in america

why cant we call ourselves NATIVE AMERICANS

 

Yep, another PC term used inappropiately by a group who can't give up on the fact that a bunch of Europeans came to this continent and populated it.

And yes, born here means NATIVE AMERICAN to me.

Could care less what my ancesters did to anyone or where they came from.

My theory is that some people like to have something to be against. If space aliens invaded us tomorrow, I bet all the earthlings would join together as one people and be against the space aliens instead of each other.

Actually, I think I've met some really fun space aliens in my time...

[Ono]

if you were born in america

why cant we call ourselves NATIVE AMERICANS

 

Yep, another PC term used inappropiately by a group who can't give up on the fact that a bunch of Europeans came to this continent and populated it.

And yes, born here means NATIVE AMERICAN to me.

Could care less what my ancesters did to anyone or where they came from.

Native American in my personal opinion means Indian decent. NOT Eastern Indian...as in India. Native American is to me my homage.....real life Indians on the plains, in the USA........doing whatever they do. I, here in the USA, look at Indians as Americans. American-Indian.....get it?? I am one. I am from the Penobscot tribe of Maine which was from Canada in a different name. I claim my Penobscot heritage.
Sorry if I offend anyone here......I do not understand why heritage of peeps is an issue.....shouldn't be. I want justice for Natalee and her family. Let's move on.

Ah...Hello Maine Penobscot!  I have some Algonquin ( from one of the Canadian Algonquin tribes ) blood within my veins as well !!

[Tylergal]

if you were born in america

why cant we call ourselves NATIVE AMERICANS

 

Yep, another PC term used inappropiately by a group who can't give up on the fact that a bunch of Europeans came to this continent and populated it.

And yes, born here means NATIVE AMERICAN to me.

Could care less what my ancesters did to anyone or where they came from.

Native American in my personal opinion means Indian decent. NOT Eastern Indian...as in India. Native American is to me my homage.....real life Indians on the plains, in the USA........doing whatever they do. I, here in the USA, look at Indians as Americans. American-Indian.....get it?? I am one. I am from the Penobscot tribe of Maine which was from Canada in a different name. I claim my Penobscot heritage.
Sorry if I offend anyone here......I do not understand why heritage of peeps is an issue.....shouldn't be. I want justice for Natalee and her family. Let's move on.

Ah...Hello Maine Penobscot!  I have some Algonquin ( from one of the Canadian Algonquin tribes ) blood within my veins as well !!

and space cadets....

[Tylergal]

They are trying to run the clock out with the two-year statute of limitations on rape/murder, whatever in that country, Aruba, lawless hell hole that it is.

[Ono]

Hi ya'll!

I have been reading and keeping up. I was so proud the other night when Beth basically complimented the work done by you guys in gathering and publishing information about Natalee.

mrd red-----------my prayers are so with you and your Dad.

Kacky Lacky: I have wondered how and where you were!  Merry Christmas!

[San]

They are trying to run the clock out with the two-year statute of limitations on rape/murder, whatever in that country, Aruba, lawless hell hole that it is.

I agree Tyler.

[Ono]

Big day tomorrow for J2K (yes, Joran also...according to MF/Carlo).

Any predictions?

They will all be given a free pass.

[blah]

Big day tomorrow for J2K (yes, Joran also...according to MF/Carlo).

Any predictions?

They will all be given a free pass.

there will, some day, be a national holliday in aruba in their honor

[Ono]

Just posted by AB on the front page of SM:

I’m from the Netherlands. First I saw the show of Peter R. de Vries, see #27.
Now Peter R. de Vries was interviewed on TV by Robert Jensen, he is the ‘Dutch David Letterman’ with a a lot of Dutch viewers. Jensen also had Beth Twitty live on the phone.

Jensen asked Peter R. de Vries: “What do you think happend?”
And de Vries had this very good anwear. He said: “I just have a very long list of facts and the facts speak for themselves”. I think this kind of media attention in The Netherlands is very good for this case.
He also said: “I was only on Aruba for a few days with one other person and I have all this information, I wonder what happens if The Netherlands are sending a whole team for a few weeks…”

A friend of mine is living in Arnhem near Zevenaar, the place where Joran is living, and she said to me that it’s the talk of the day over there.

Just want to share…
ab

This is encouraging to me, because, however I have chosen to wittily & lightly critique the Dutch nature, they, by nature, are extremely intelligent and are very quick to defend the innocent, once the facts are compelling. This is one reason why failure to prosecute this case in a timely manner has been so blatantly shocking to me....what the hell goes on in Aruba ??????????? Holland: Wake up! Aruba is giving you a very bad name.

[COLOMBO]

At the time, Janssen said that Carlo interviewing the security guard was very detrimental to the case. It gave Joran insight into what the new K2 story was.

Bottom Line - Antonio Carlo was willing to break the law and put his career in jeopordy to assist Joran. I suspect the list of people who did the same is extensive.

the security guards were released on the 13th.  Did Carlo talk to them after they were released?  If so, how was talking to the, breaking the law?

It seems to me if he did break the law it was to rat Joran out by telling Jansen he was involved in the disappearance.

SG released on the 13th:

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 10:36 am
The boy was picked up at 23:00 on Sunday at Mickey D’s. Sneaked out later. Was on time for school. Don’t mix things up.
(interesting choice of words-what happens when you DO mix things up)

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:30 pm
Paulus has been picked up.

Simian Says: June 24th, 2005 at 10:35 am P 1181
Anybody wants a blessing from Saint Alibi?

Simian Says: June 24th, 2005 at 5:57 pm
The waters are low. The street are full. The night of Saint John.[/u] The fires will burn all around on the island (Light the fires!). The smoke will clear tomorrow morning.

Simian Says: June 25th, 2005 at 7:41 pm
Kalpoes went home. Joran stayed behind. Somebody had to come get him.

Simian Says: June 25th, 2005 at 7:59 pm
The fires burned high and bright. Even Saint John denied he knew. The smoke will clear soon.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:10 pm
Simian, older PVDS had one or two cards up his sleeve. They have been played, and lost. Will one of the cards sing?

Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 2:58 pm
(1) The music man’s song was not on the bill.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:09 pm
(2) Simian, who else plays in the orchestra? A Babylonian….

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:14 pm
Simian, The Sumerians do not like the Babylonian intrusion.
The Babylonian card may be tossed from the table and crushed under Sumerian feet (or feat)….

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 9:58 pm
DirtyHand knows the Babylonians that provided escort after the 2 shivas left

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:18 pm
If the Alibi is broken by DirtyHand the walls of Babylon will shake

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:53 pm
DirtyHand is the key
He walks with the elders
He walks in all houses
And he walked with the fallen elder
he was the hidden card that was played

Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 11:23 pm
Who took the boy to the party? Who took him home? Therein lies the third act. Look up the Simian’s posts from days ago.

[klaasend]

Posted by Victor at FOB regarding the photoshopped picture:

I saw him on Jensen tonight and he talked about the picture. He said the tip was given to him by the person who made the pic and who claimed a friend of Joran had ordered to have the picture made.

He said about the picture, since he seems to believe it was indeed a friend of Joran who had the picture made (wasn't it a gmail adress? a provider emailadress would not even prove who ordered it but that aside).

De Vries unlike Daniel did NOT say he felt there were sinister motives behind the picture (such as creating false evidence), he said that if Joran knew about it (since he was in the cc, which I saw was a gmail adress) that it was not a respectable thing to do since the girl probably passed away was missing etc.

[Ono]

Posted by All10Suspects at RU:

http://tinyurl.com/tef95


(snipped)
Also Friday, the court barred van der Sloot's lawyer, Antonio Carlo, from visiting the teen, effectively removing him from the case, said Attorney General spokeswoman Mariaine Croes.

As a result, the van der Sloots retained two more attorneys for the defense of their son, Richie Kock and Arjan Debie.

The court granted prosecutors' request to remove Carlo because he had visited one of two former security guards who had been detained and released in the case, authorities said.

Croes said the Dutch teenager has a team of lawyers, so Carlo's removal will not leave van der Sloot without representation. The spokeswoman is not related to Steve Croes.

Carlo did not return calls seeking comment.

So Antonio Carlo was removed from the case around June 17, 2005.
Was this after is meeting with KJ? Could this mean he really did have
a meeting with KJ saying Joran had something to to with KJ?

No doubt the press release regarding Carlo having visited one of the two security guards was the 'cover story' for what was really going on behind the scenes with his contact, etc. with KJ ??

[blah]

SG released on the 13th:

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 10:36 am
The boy was picked up at 23:00 on Sunday at Mickey D’s. Sneaked out later. Was on time for school. Don’t mix things up.
(interesting choice of words-what happens when you DO mix things up)

Simian Says: June 23rd, 2005 at 2:30 pm
Paulus has been picked up.

Simian Says: June 24th, 2005 at 10:35 am P 1181
Anybody wants a blessing from Saint Alibi?

Simian Says: June 24th, 2005 at 5:57 pm
The waters are low. The street are full. The night of Saint John.[/u] The fires will burn all around on the island (Light the fires!). The smoke will clear tomorrow morning.

Simian Says: June 25th, 2005 at 7:41 pm
Kalpoes went home. Joran stayed behind. Somebody had to come get him.

Simian Says: June 25th, 2005 at 7:59 pm
The fires burned high and bright. Even Saint John denied he knew. The smoke will clear soon.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:10 pm
Simian, older PVDS had one or two cards up his sleeve. They have been played, and lost. Will one of the cards sing?

Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 2:58 pm
(1) The music man’s song was not on the bill.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:09 pm
(2) Simian, who else plays in the orchestra? A Babylonian….

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:14 pm
Simian, The Sumerians do not like the Babylonian intrusion.
The Babylonian card may be tossed from the table and crushed under Sumerian feet (or feat)….

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 9:58 pm
DirtyHand knows the Babylonians that provided escort after the 2 shivas left

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:18 pm
If the Alibi is broken by DirtyHand the walls of Babylon will shake

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:53 pm
DirtyHand is the key
He walks with the elders
He walks in all houses
And he walked with the fallen elder
he was the hidden card that was played

Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 11:23 pm
Who took the boy to the party? Who took him home? Therein lies the third act. Look up the Simian’s posts from days ago.

I have just read this thing about 3 and a half times and I just dont know what I'm supposed to be getting out of it  

 

[memphis]

I'm getting very confused by this Carlo/Janssen thing.

If DeVries information is correct, then this is how I see it (and it's a feminine perspective so, of course it has that relational slant   ).

Antonio Carlo is Joran's attorney and at some point he realizes that Joran is heavily involved, or even guilty of murder, etc. etc.  

Instead of removing himself from the case, he secretly goes to Janssen and tells her Joran is guilty, and that she has to be the one to find the proof. He wants justice to be served, or something that seems to be noble, but why doesn't he just resign from the case? Is he afraid? Also, he must have trusted Janssen to stick his neck out like this, but boy was he mistaken!

Janssen goes and summarizes everything that transpired in writing!? Whoa! To me that sounds like Janssen was sending a loud message to Carlo. I wonder if this was when he realized he was in trouble. She had to have known that Carlo's secret meeting with her wasn't something to put in writing. Wouldn't she??

Just say that JVDS now knows that Carlo not only thought J was guilty, but was trying to make sure he got convicted. That is no small thing. I can't imagine JVDS would retain Carlo as Joran's lawyer. Carlo is now a HUGE problem. However, PVDS is then hired by Carlo's law office and for the last year the two have been working together. Who was responsible for hiring PVDS? Wouldn't that be a very threatening move towards Carlo?

Can you imagine the two of them going to work everyday, passing each other in the hall, etc.? I sure can't. This wasn't just a little misunderstanding between them. PVDS would do anything to help his son.

So, if what DeVries relayed is true, I can only conclude that Carlo must be a very frightened man.

Feel free to help me out here.

[Ono]

At the time, Janssen said that Carlo interviewing the security guard was very detrimental to the case. It gave Joran insight into what the new K2 story was.

Bottom Line - Antonio Carlo was willing to break the law and put his career in jeopordy to assist Joran. I suspect the list of people who did the same is extensive.

Well...actually, from the very first reports of this, I never ever believed that Antonio Carlo was stupid enough to visit the security guards. And I bet I wasn't the only one....that was a cover story..................

[klaasend]

O/T - my sister in law had twin boys rather late in life.  She is 50 and they are 3yrs old.    I just ordered two of these for them for Christmas    You don't think she'll mind do you??  



Kids of all ages will love twisting their words into a whole new voice. Speaking into this translucent, hand held toy transforms their voice to sound like a robot, alien or spaceman. 8"L x 4 1/2"W x 7 1/4"H. Uses one 9 volt battery (included). Age 3 and up.