Natalee Case Discussion #747 4/11 - 4/17/08

[Destiny]

Morning Monkeys!!!

Patrick responded to an e-mail that Justice for Natalee sent out in regards to our DC protest. He is posting his response on his website also. Although I don't agree, I respect his opinion and spoke mine too. I posted both in the DC protest thread. Please take a moment and voice your opnions on the matter.

And let's really be heard in DC!!!

MEET ME IN DC...... MEET ME IN DC .......JUNE 21ST..... MEET ME IN DC...MEET ME IN DC

ldstlou ... I fail to understand how those who are sincerely striving for justice in the Natalee Holloway case believe that this objective can be met by cooperating with and upholding those who have prevented justice from prevailing since the getgo.

Obviously ... the dynamics encompassing the coverup ... the corrupt investigation ... is not comprehended or ... believed.

Janet

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2778.0

Exactly Janet!!!! You said it all.

Here was my response to Patrick. Hope others will post their responses and views in the DC protest thread.

Patrick,
It was a pleasure to receive an e-mail from you, I had no idea you were on this e-mail list. I have nothing but respect for what you have done for Beth and Natalee. It must have been  very difficult for you, dealing with Joran for all those months, but very rewarding to you in the end. I am so glad I had the opportunity to hear from you, and to respond to you.
 
I have had the pleasure of getting to know some members of Natalee's family and they have nothing but great things to say about the local Arubans, I am sure they are absolutely wonderful people. Everyone on this email has their own opinion, including yourself. I just want to take a moment and express my opinions on the matter and hope you will respect my view as I respect yours. I have a 7 year old son. He is the light of my life!! I don't know if I could survive if something happened to him. I know if he died as Natalee did, I would find away to make it through until I could find Justice for him and bring him home for a proper burial, just as Beth is doing. I would owe him that. As a parent I am sure you can understand that. I lead the protest here in St Louis a few weeks ago. Our message was simple, no Justice for Natalee, no Tourists for Aruba. Although I have no ill feelings towards the people of Aruba, how could I, I have never met them, I do however believe strongly that if you are going to invite people to your home, you must insure their safety, I have absolutely no confidence what so ever, that the police and officials of Aruba have our safety and best interests in mind. None Patrick. My lack of confidence does not come from hatred, nor prejudice, it comes from experience, it comes from watching this case from day one. It comes from seeing the reality of how Beth and her family were treated, how Dave Holloway was treated, and how Aruban officials made a choice when Natalee disappeared, and that choice was that American tourism dollars were more important than sending Natalee home.
Now as a mother, I teach my son, the choices that you make have consequences. Aruban officials and their Tourism Associations made a choice, they decided it was more important to keep their reputation as a "safe island" than to bring Natalee's murderers to justice. Their choices have consequences, one of which is I , as well as many others, no longer feel Aruba is a safe place, nor an honorable place. There is absolutely no honor, nor pride in how Natalee was treated, nor in how her family and friends were treated. I believe in honor, I believe in respect. I think you do also Patrick, I think you have shown those qualities are important to you. I think you believe in liberty and justice therefore I hope you understand my reasons for protesting Aruba's Tourists Associations coming to American seeking our hard earned dollars we save for our families to rest and enjoy our much earned vacations, without showing us the respect we deserve for choosing Aruba. Aruba lost my respect Patrick, as a result of their choices, they lost the respect of a lot of Americans. Until they earn our respect back, I will protest their attempts to draw us to their island for our family vacations.
You are correct in saying crime happens everywhere. We have plenty here in St Louis!!! The difference Patrick is that here in St Louis, if a crime occurs, I have every confidence in the world that I can go to my police and local politicians and receive justice. The irony of Aruba billing itself as the safest island is, that in order to sell that notion, they can't acknowledge that they have any crime. As a result of billing itself as the safest island, when they do have a crime, they have to cover it up...can you see the vicious cycle? And almost 3 years later, we don't see anything has changed.
So until Aruba takes responsibility for their crime, which as you said, happens everywhere. Until Aruba takes responsibility for what happened to Natalee. Until Aruba takes responsibility for the cover up of Natalee's death. Until Aruba takes responsibility for what they put Beth and Dave and Jug and all of Natalee's family through. Until they take responsibility for what they put members of Scared Monkeys through. Until Aruba takes responsibility for watching family and friends digging through mounds of garbage and sending them on wild goose chases to crack houses. Until Aruba takes responsibility for funding websites designed to counter our efforts to find Natalee. Until Aruban officials acknowledge that they spent millions on disinformation campaigns and campaigns to discredit and disgrace Natalee's reputation and that of her family and friends who til this day, still mourn her and long for a proper burial. Until I know for sure, that the youth of Aruba have stopped looking at our daughters as "easy prey"; slip them a date rape drug, rape them and drop them off at their hotels just in time for them to catch their plane home.Until Aruba takes responsibility for their choices, I will be there at these protests with my message, No Justice for Natalee, No tourism for Aruba. I hope you can respect my opnion, as I have respected yours.
Thank you,
"ldstlou"

 

EXCELLENT!!!!  KUDOS!!!!!  A WINNER!!!!!

[ldstlou]

This burned my britches, although I will respect his opinion. This was copied from Patrick's website and posted at RU.
 <snipped>

In all due respect to Mr. Eem, because I do appreciate him exposing Joran, he was in Holland for most of time all the corruption went on and the case never even got much traction until over there until Joran confessed. If he had followed the case like we have week in and week out he would know it is clear as a bell the Dutchies in the government, police department, prosecutors office and judiciary purposely corrupted the case.

We witnessed them day by day, week by week, year by year, do everything in their power to keep Joran out of prison. Patrick needs to go back and do some serious reading here before he scratches his scalp over whether they are corrupt or not.

Amen!!! I agree. And unless you know all of the facts, I don't think you should be posting an e-mail you received on your website w/out permission and then dedrading it.

I am thankful for what Patrick did. Glad he is getting a book deal out of this...but he wasn't there when they called Beth and Dave in over Thanksgiving just months ago with "new evidence" and instead interrogated them for hours. The corruption continues, and so do the protests!!!

[ldstlou]

This burned my britches, although I will respect his opinion. This was copied from Patrick's website and posted at RU.
 <snipped>

In all due respect to Mr. Eem, because I do appreciate him exposing Joran, he was in Holland for most of time all the corruption went on and the case never even got much traction until over there until Joran confessed. If he had followed the case like we have week in and week out he would know it is clear as a bell the Dutchies in the government, police department, prosecutors office and judiciary purposely corrupted the case.

We witnessed them day by day, week by week, year by year, do everything in their power to keep Joran out of prison. Patrick needs to go back and do some serious reading here before he scratches his scalp over whether they are corrupt or not.

Amen!!! I agree. And unless you know all of the facts, I don't think you should be posting an e-mail you received on your website w/out permission and then dedrading it.

I am thankful for what Patrick did. Glad he is getting a book deal out of this...but he wasn't there when they called Beth and Dave in over Thanksgiving just months ago with "new evidence" and instead interrogated them for hours. The corruption continues, and so do the protests!!!

furthermore!!! If Patrick was working on this for 5 months, and ALE was aware of it and was kept apprised of the situation, makes it even worse that during the same period Mos was interrogating Dave and Beth about Natalee's "habits" !!
THE CORRUPTION CONTINUES AND SO DO THE PROTESTS!!!!!

[Tamikosmom]

Patrick is correct to some extent ... Beth may have received a measure of peace when she compared Joran's reference to "shaking" and ... the questions presented to Jug and her by Dennis Jacobs on June 1, 2005 in regards to "seizures.  She knows in her heart that her daughter will never be coming home.  However ... a measure of peace was not the only emotion that Beth feels.  Beth words to Geraldo imply that she is a believer in justice..

Janet

+++++++++++

Beth Twitty
Geraldo At Large
February 10, 2008

Geraldo:

The Shock of actually seeing him saying those words, when Peter showed you that video, your reaction was visceral? It was emotional? It must be something you will never forget?

Beth:

Well, I wanted to come through the tv and I wanted to kill him and I would have peeled his skin off his face, yes!

Transcript - Heli (RU)

[ldstlou]

Patrick is correct to some extent ... Beth may have received a measure of peace when she compared Joran's reference to "shaking" and ... the questions presented to Jug and her by Dennis Jacobs on June 1, 2005 in regards to "seizures.  She knows in her heart that her daughter will never be coming home.  However ... a measure of peace was not the only emotion that Beth feels.  Beth words to Geraldo imply that she is a believer in justice..

Janet

+++++++++++

Beth Twitty
Geraldo At Large
February 10, 2008

Geraldo:

The Shock of actually seeing him saying those words, when Peter showed you that video, your reaction was visceral? It was emotional? It must be something you will never forget?

Beth:

Well, I wanted to come through the tv and I wanted to kill him and I would have peeled his skin off his face, yes!

Transcript - Heli (RU)

Hope she gets the chance one day!!!

[Tamikosmom]

Lou ... thank you from the bottom of my heart.  Your words articulated perfectly the way it is.

 

Janet

[sandy leiva]

Lou ... thank you from the bottom of my heart.  Your words articulated perfectly the way it is.

 

Janet

who in this world could blame that poor mother for all the horror she has had to endure over her daughters case and fate in aruba--nobody she is just human after all. Bravo  may I join you in this monkey dance.? SL

[ldstlou]

Lou ... thank you from the bottom of my heart.  Your words articulated perfectly the way it is.

 

Janet

You are the one who always says it perfectly...but thanks Janet. Now come to DC so we can all meet!!!!

[Rob]

horse hockey!!! criminals DO roam free on Aruba... and I wish they would just stop that line of BS. Not only do they roam free - they are flocking there as by evidence of the National Century scandal....it's more bullshit!!!

if someone is facing a death sentence here in the US they would be an idiot to run to Mexico and not Aruba. In Mexico they will ship you back provided the capital sentence is taken off the table. On Aruba they will give you a green card and a new identity and hook you up with a casino job. JACKPOT!

The boycott is voluntary!!!! so.... why would I take my life in my own hands again? that makes no sense. Even if I am not a gang rape victim, I could end up like Gary Makings or Buddy Larson... or little Max... no effin' thanks. I'll stay in the states and see some areas I have always wanted to see.

And this malarky of "the beach" is really really pissing me off. The Sloots achieved their objected - insulate Paulus and remove the house of horrors from just about everyone's memory. I bet that works real nice when Anita has her garden club over. No crime here... look the other way... my house is not a rape and murder home. I have no idea how anyone can look at that woman with out wanting to throw her in the ocean... utterly repulsive.

so thanks - NOT... I want the truth and not a portion of it.

BOYCOTT ROLLS ON!!! AND I'LL KEEP TELLING PEOPLE NOT TO GO THERE.

[ldstlou]

horse hockey!!! criminals DO roam free on Aruba... and I wish they would just stop that line of BS. Not only do they roam free - they are flocking there as by evidence of the National Century scandal....it's more bullshit!!!

if someone is facing a death sentence here in the US they would be an idiot to run to Mexico and not Aruba. In Mexico they will ship you back provided the capital sentence is taken off the table. On Aruba they will give you a green card and a new identity and hook you up with a casino job. JACKPOT!

The boycott is voluntary!!!! so.... why would I take my life in my own hands again? that makes no sense. Even if I am not a gang rape victim, I could end up like Gary Makings or Buddy Larson... or little Max... no effin' thanks. I'll stay in the states and see some areas I have always wanted to see.

And this malarky of "the beach" is really really pissing me off. The Sloots achieved their objected - insulate Paulus and remove the house of horrors from just about everyone's memory. I bet that works real nice when Anita has her garden club over. No crime here... look the other way... my house is not a rape and murder home. I have no idea how anyone can look at that woman with out wanting to throw her in the ocean... utterly repulsive.

so thanks - NOT... I want the truth and not a portion of it.

BOYCOTT ROLLS ON!!! AND I'LL KEEP TELLING PEOPLE NOT TO GO THERE.

are you coming to DC???!!!
Let's have the Monkey get together we have all wanted to do for years in DC!!!!!

[Rob]

RIGHT!!! like Paulus rolled down to the beach, examined the situation, got back in his rickety old truck, went home and then started looking up the effects of alcohol and drugs on teenagers. RIGGGGHHHT!!!

and then he goes back to the beach and places Natalee there - outta sight outta mind... sure you did Paulus.

Abducted twice in one night and the second time by a necrophiliac. Sure.... sure...

who buys this stuff?

[Rob]

Lis, I'll see what I can do... I can not say for sure at this time... but I will try.

[ldstlou]

RIGHT!!! like Paulus rolled down to the beach, examined the situation, got back in his rickety old truck, went home and then started looking up the effects of alcohol and drugs on teenagers. RIGGGGHHHT!!!

and then he goes back to the beach and places Natalee there - outta sight outta mind... sure you did Paulus.

Abducted twice in one night and the second time by a necrophiliac. Sure.... sure...

who buys this stuff?

and HEEELLLLOOOOOOO!!!!
They were asking if Natalee had a history of seizures within 48 hours of her dissappearance...but of course there was no cober up. Bull crap!!!!

THE CORRUPTION CONTINUES AND SO DO THE PROTESTS.....NO JUSTICE FOR NATALEE, NO TOURISTS FOR ARUBA!!!!

[Destiny]

Lis, I'll see what I can do... I can not say for sure at this time... but I will try.

What are the dates again?

[ldstlou]

RIGHT!!! like Paulus rolled down to the beach, examined the situation, got back in his rickety old truck, went home and then started looking up the effects of alcohol and drugs on teenagers. RIGGGGHHHT!!!

and then he goes back to the beach and places Natalee there - outta sight outta mind... sure you did Paulus.

Abducted twice in one night and the second time by a necrophiliac. Sure.... sure...

who buys this stuff?

and HEEELLLLOOOOOOO!!!!
They were asking if Natalee had a history of seizures within 48 hours of her dissappearance...but of course there was no cober up. Bull crap!!!!

THE CORRUPTION CONTINUES AND SO DO THE PROTESTS.....NO JUSTICE FOR NATALEE, NO TOURISTS FOR ARUBA!!!!

oops...no COVER up...lol

[ldstlou]

Lis, I'll see what I can do... I can not say for sure at this time... but I will try.

What are the dates again?

June 21st-24th. 21st and 22nd is a Saturday and a Sunday...those are the days we want to hit big!!!

[Tamikosmom]

What I find so frustrating is that Peter Devries/Patrick van der Eem as well as ... the the crew of the Persistence .... just do not get it!  In their sincere quest for justice for Natalee Holloway ... in their naïveté they align themselves with those who are responsible for the coverup.

The Dutch ... Aruban officials and ... Hans Mos were aware of Patrick Vander Eem and Peter Devries' mission. This is why I cannot trust that VDS' were not forewarned about the forthcoming "fifth segment" when Joran was detained in December, 2007.  How do Peter and Patrick know that there was not a collaborated plan in regards to what Joran would say while fully realizing that he was being record.

I suspect that the plan was that Joran would implicate "only" himself and ... distance all other who were involved or aware of the coverup.  He was assured that he would not be held legally responsible.  However ... it was hoped that the outcome would be that Natalee's family would give up their quest for justice when they were given a measure of closure.

Janet

+++++++++

Arubans wary of fifth car trip in Holloway case
Monday 25 February 2008
 
Dutch tv crime reporter Peter R de Vries set up a fifth car trip to try and get Joran van der Sloot to confess to murdering US teenager Natalee Holloway after the Aruban public prosecution department said the original four recordings did not contain enough evidence, the Volkskrant reported on Saturday.
 
Aruban officials told De Vries and his team at a secret hotel meeting that the tapes did not contain enough new evidence, the paper says in a reconstruction of events surrounding the tv programme which claimed to solve the mystery of her disappearance.

Aruban public prosecutor Hans Mos told the paper he did not want to have anything to do with the extra car trip because he was afraid it could be construed as entrapment and blow the case.
 
The final car trip with Van der Sloot and his 'friend' Patrick van der Eem took place on January 29 in a borrowed car which had been hastily kitted out with recording equipment, the paper said. The original had already been sold.

During that trip, Van der Sloot said he was not sure if Natalee had been dead when a friend dumped her body at sea.  After the press release was issued claiming the case had been solved but without giving any further details, De Vries told the paper he hoped that Van der Sloot would again phone his 'friend'.
 
But website VKMag picked up a page on De Vries' website which identified Van der Sloot. The page had been prepared for release after the programme was aired on Sunday but had gone live by mistake.

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2008/02/arubans_wary_of_fifth_car_trip.php


Wednesday, February 06, 2008
Joran and OM talk tomorrow in the Netherlands

ORANJESTAD – The conversation between Joran van der Sloot and the Public Prosecutor (OM) will most probably take place in the Netherlands tomorrow, said Joran’s lawyer Ariean de Bie.  Van der Sloot indicated last Monday that he is willing to be interrogated again by the police. According to Van der Eem, Joran continued to bombard him with email and sms until the day of the disclosure. 

After he had met Joran in a poker game in the casino, Van der Eem had approached the Dutch police last year with the suggestion to unmask him.  Justice questions the fact that he had given himself up.  Due to the fact that there is no law for special powers to investigate (BOB), deploy a civil informant in Aruba is unfortunately impossible, but this is different in the Netherlands.  Using police-informants is possible, but with ‘a lot of trouble’.  “But that is going to change”, said an insider in the OM.  “A BOB law is in the make and will probably be presented soon.”

http://amigoe.com/english/

[ldstlou]

Lis, I'll see what I can do... I can not say for sure at this time... but I will try.

HEY!!! I am driving through Ohio...14 hours!! I will pick up anyone along the way who wants to join us!!!

If I can do it you can too!!!

[Rob]

Questions for Paulus

Why were both of your vehicles confiscated?

Why were you looking up the effects of Drugs and Alcohol on teenagers in the middle of the night?

Why were you looking up the phone numbers of attorneys in the middle of the night?

What is your timeline?

Why did you say you left the casino when you are clearly still there?

Were your kids at home or in Holland?

Where is you cell phone?

Who is pulling the strings for you?

Why were documents missing when you were cleaning out your desk and fired?

- that's just for starters.

please feel free to add.

[ldstlou]

What I find so frustrating is that Peter Devries/Patrick van der Eem as well as ... the the crew of the Persistence .... just do not get it!  In their sincere quest for justice for Natalee Holloway ... in their naïveté they align themselves with those who are responsible for the coverup.

The Dutch ... Aruban officials and ... Hans Mos were aware of Patrick Vander Eem and Peter Devries' mission. This is why I cannot trust that VDS' were not forewarned about the forthcoming "fifth segment" when Joran was detained in December, 2007.  How do Peter and Patrick know that there was not a collaborated plan in regards to what Joran would say while fully realizing that he was being record.

I suspect that the plan was that Joran would implicate "only" himself and ... distance all other who were involved or aware of the coverup.  He was assured that he would not be held legally responsible.  However ... it was hoped that the outcome would be that Natalee's family would give up their quest for justice when they were given a measure of closure.

Janet

+++++++++

Arubans wary of fifth car trip in Holloway case
Monday 25 February 2008
 
Dutch tv crime reporter Peter R de Vries set up a fifth car trip to try and get Joran van der Sloot to confess to murdering US teenager Natalee Holloway after the Aruban public prosecution department said the original four recordings did not contain enough evidence, the Volkskrant reported on Saturday.
 
Aruban officials told De Vries and his team at a secret hotel meeting that the tapes did not contain enough new evidence, the paper says in a reconstruction of events surrounding the tv programme which claimed to solve the mystery of her disappearance.

Aruban public prosecutor Hans Mos told the paper he did not want to have anything to do with the extra car trip because he was afraid it could be construed as entrapment and blow the case.
 
The final car trip with Van der Sloot and his 'friend' Patrick van der Eem took place on January 29 in a borrowed car which had been hastily kitted out with recording equipment, the paper said. The original had already been sold.

During that trip, Van der Sloot said he was not sure if Natalee had been dead when a friend dumped her body at sea.  After the press release was issued claiming the case had been solved but without giving any further details, De Vries told the paper he hoped that Van der Sloot would again phone his 'friend'.
 
But website VKMag picked up a page on De Vries' website which identified Van der Sloot. The page had been prepared for release after the programme was aired on Sunday but had gone live by mistake.

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2008/02/arubans_wary_of_fifth_car_trip.php


Wednesday, February 06, 2008
Joran and OM talk tomorrow in the Netherlands

ORANJESTAD – The conversation between Joran van der Sloot and the Public Prosecutor (OM) will most probably take place in the Netherlands tomorrow, said Joran’s lawyer Ariean de Bie.  Van der Sloot indicated last Monday that he is willing to be interrogated again by the police. According to Van der Eem, Joran continued to bombard him with email and sms until the day of the disclosure. 

After he had met Joran in a poker game in the casino, Van der Eem had approached the Dutch police last year with the suggestion to unmask him.  Justice questions the fact that he had given himself up.  Due to the fact that there is no law for special powers to investigate (BOB), deploy a civil informant in Aruba is unfortunately impossible, but this is different in the Netherlands.  Using police-informants is possible, but with ‘a lot of trouble’.  “But that is going to change”, said an insider in the OM.  “A BOB law is in the make and will probably be presented soon.”

http://amigoe.com/english/

My frustrations too!!! Too many people jumped in years later and thing they know what is happening...and they don't!!!

I am glad Beth received some peace also, and I think it really did help that she finally knows what happened.