Natalee Case Discussion #793 1/13/09 - 1/18/09

[Kermit]

[Tamikosmom]

At this point what do we hope to do about the trap ?
From what I can see, not much can be done now..

Lots can be done, actually.

US officials can subpoena Persistence records, testimony from those on board, and an accounting of personal and business financials.

At that point our State Dept would have to step in, and request cooperation from Aruba/The Hague regarding the findings from step one, and obtaining evidence/testimony from the Aruban side of things.

Satisfactory results, however, may be a different story.

Jen ... the question is ... "Is the American "powers that be" taking any action."  Are words of posts submitted to private or public sites considered evidence enough for authorities to act.  Kyle Kingman only has to distance himself from from the words in his posts.  The only person that he has defamed is John Silvetti and ... I believe that John Silvetti only wants to tippy toe away from the entire issue.

Janet.

[texasmom]

thank you texasmom, I ate that tasty fly you left for me as my snack today.
ribbit

You're welcome Kermit!   

[Cageman]

Cageman,
I've been very curious since your comment about being involved in forensics.  Have you seen the pictures that were reportedly taken by the ROV on board the Persistence?  If so, would you be willing to share your thoughts on the photos?  If you're not comfortable doing so for any reason I understand.  I would just like to know your opinion if you are willing to share it.

Thanks in advance.

tm

I really wish I could enlighten you but for me it is impossible to say something useful about those photographs.

[texasmom]

Cageman,
I've been very curious since your comment about being involved in forensics.  Have you seen the pictures that were reportedly taken by the ROV on board the Persistence?  If so, would you be willing to share your thoughts on the photos?  If you're not comfortable doing so for any reason I understand.  I would just like to know your opinion if you are willing to share it.

Thanks in advance.

tm

I really wish I could enlighten you but for me it is impossible to say something useful about those photographs.

Thanks for the response Cageman.   

[jen3560]

At this point what do we hope to do about the trap ?
From what I can see, not much can be done now..

Lots can be done, actually.

US officials can subpoena Persistence records, testimony from those on board, and an accounting of personal and business financials.

At that point our State Dept would have to step in, and request cooperation from Aruba/The Hague regarding the findings from step one, and obtaining evidence/testimony from the Aruban side of things.

Satisfactory results, however, may be a different story.

Jen ... the question is ... "Is the American "powers that be" taking any action."  Are words of posts submitted to private or public sites considered evidence enough for authorities to act.  Kyle Kingman only has to distance himself from from the words in his posts.  The only person that he has defamed is John Silvetti and ... I believe that John Silvetti only wants to tippy toe away from the entire issue.

Janet.

I don't think that would be very easy for him to do, Janet.  He has shared not only some pretty powerful words, but also those images.

Both of which can be proven as being made/submitted by him.

[Anna]

I don't think our Dept of State will do anything to jeopardize the FOB base in Aruba especially now with the Ruskies entering into drilling agreements with Uncle Hugo.

That ups the ante a bit, IMO.

[Edward]

So it is believed the fellow who took the Aruba Bay video who had dark legs, actually knew the body was in the plastic he videoed, which could also be a large plastic taken from a trash container witnessed by a Colombian male. Who could also have dark legs.. Natalee's body was supposedly put into plastic and taken away in a white pick up..
 Taken to this culvert and placed there temporary..?
 later taken to another location and somehow eventually put into a crab/fish trap and dropped off the boat into 90 some feet of water..

Then there is various other witnesses and Internet bloggers and lots of thing we have discussed over the last 3.7 years now..
Take a look.. http://s66.photobucket.com/albums/h254/chicagoutfit/?start=all

Then there is Marcos near the end..

A large scale cover up by a government and or organized crime syndicate....


The one thing I have to say about all of this is,..
A famous psychic who lives in my neck of the woods was interviewed within 2 weeks of Natalee disappearing by me and I have it on tape..
She insisted at that time Natalee was in the ocean.. I believed she was in Venezuela.
She has never contacted the family ..Nor has she posted her thoughts on the Internet..
She has stayed silent.
I still have her on tape...  and The F.B.I. contacted her before I did..They wanted to know her opinion.. She also told them Natalee was in the ocean..
 Never said she was in a fish/crab trap and has never been contacted for approximate location of where Natalee may have been placed..
 I remember her words about the people involved.. Very dangerous people/ she sensed drug dealers and murders.. Also her words about how far out...Way Out !
 Also her last words.. Before this is over Many Nations will be involved.
It is all on tape... It is dated..
It appears she was correct.. and she always impressed me as honesty without any hesitation ..
Her name, Annette Martin.
I found it very interesting the fbi called her so quickly.. as she has advised them before.

There were other predictions .. Like this one who felt compelled to contact the family.
 http://www.marybrents.com/missing.htm

But Annette has strick rules on this.. I am just amazed at how accurate she was.
I did contact her and gave her a link to the Persistance web site.. I wonder what she thinks of all of this today..

She did say that the body would not be found..
Oh well.

[Tamikosmom]

At this point what do we hope to do about the trap ?
From what I can see, not much can be done now..

Lots can be done, actually.

US officials can subpoena Persistence records, testimony from those on board, and an accounting of personal and business financials.

At that point our State Dept would have to step in, and request cooperation from Aruba/The Hague regarding the findings from step one, and obtaining evidence/testimony from the Aruban side of things.

Satisfactory results, however, may be a different story.

Jen ... the question is ... "Is the American "powers that be" taking any action."  Are words of posts submitted to private or public sites considered evidence enough for authorities to act.  Kyle Kingman only has to distance himself from from the words in his posts.  The only person that he has defamed is John Silvetti and ... I believe that John Silvetti only wants to tippy toe away from the entire issue.

Janet.

I don't think that would be very easy for him to do, Janet.  He has shared not only some pretty powerful words, but also those images.

Both of which can be proven as being made/submitted by him.

Jen ... I sincerely hope you are right.

Considering Beth Holloway ... John Q. Kelly and ... the FBI have received all the information/ images four/five months ago ... why is the ball not rolling more quickly.  Time is an ally of all those associated with actions that have prevented justice form prevailing for Natalee Holloway.

Janet

[Tamikosmom]

I don't think our Dept of State will do anything to jeopardize the FOB base in Aruba especially now with the Ruskies entering into drilling agreements with Uncle Hugo.

That ups the ante a bit, IMO.

I agree Anna.  It is all political and ... the tiny island of Aruba is holding the United States of America hostage.

My youngest son's wise Dutch American FIL believes that Aruba's close ties with Hugo Chavez is at the root of both the Netherland and the United States' tolerance in regards to the corrupt Aruban administration.

Hugo Chávez is so dangerious to the security of world. He has a goal which IS NOT hidden ... a goal which will ultimately threaten the security of United States of America. He had a plan is to acquire one small nation at a time ... building up strength throughout the Caribbean. Think about it ... Aruba is the stepping stone from Venezuala to American ... Cuba is a stone throw from the mainland.

The United States administration knows this ...  yet it continues to appease ... tolerate this dictator. This approach only makes what was once the most feared/respected nation on the face of the earth appear weak and ... gives this dictator who is drunk with power more confidence to further his global agenda.

It is a truly sad day when this dictator is allowed to speak before the UN referring to the President of the United States as the "devil" and ... have no fear of retaliation.

If the United States goes down ... so does every appeasing/tolerant democratic nation in the world ... Canada included.

The free world has to wake up ... left-wing dictators as well as Islamic nations are gaining strength through our weaknesses.

“The reality is that we must find peace through strength.”
Ronald Reagan, 1983

Janet

+++++++++++++++

Chavez: Bush 'devil'; U.S. 'on the way down'
POSTED: 1726 GMT (0126 HKT), September 21, 2006

http://edition.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/americas/09/20/chavez.un/index.html

[Keepthefaith]

So what person had the inside knowledge of the cover-up from beginning to end that could possibly have recorded this?Why would they have put their life at risk unless they were possibly gonna be the fall guy?

[Keepthefaith]

So what person had the inside knowledge of the cover-up from beginning to end that could possibly have recorded this?Why would they have put their life at risk unless they were possibly gonna be the fall guy?

Tj Ward,Colombian witnesses.I'm waiting Greta...

[wreck]

So what person had the inside knowledge of the cover-up from beginning to end that could possibly have recorded this?Why would they have put their life at risk unless they were possibly gonna be the fall guy?

I still think it was someone "documenting" the cover-up to ensure the security guards would not be railroaded.

[Buckeye]

So what person had the inside knowledge of the cover-up from beginning to end that could possibly have recorded this?Why would they have put their life at risk unless they were possibly gonna be the fall guy?

I still think it was someone "documenting" the cover-up to ensure the security guards would not be railroaded.

I agree.  They were concerned for their friend, so they started following the "coverup" team.  My guess is that this wasn't the first time one of their own got framed.

[truthseeker2]

So it is believed the fellow who took the Aruba Bay video who had dark legs, actually knew the body was in the plastic he videoed, which could also be a large plastic taken from a trash container witnessed by a Colombian male. Who could also have dark legs.. Natalee's body was supposedly put into plastic and taken away in a white pick up..
 Taken to this culvert and placed there temporary..?
 later taken to another location and somehow eventually put into a crab/fish trap and dropped off the boat into 90 some feet of water..

Then there is various other witnesses and Internet bloggers and lots of thing we have discussed over the last 3.7 years now..
Take a look.. http://s66.photobucket.com/albums/h254/chicagoutfit/?start=all

Then there is Marcos near the end..

A large scale cover up by a government and or organized crime syndicate....


The one thing I have to say about all of this is,..
A famous psychic who lives in my neck of the woods was interviewed within 2 weeks of Natalee disappearing by me and I have it on tape..
She insisted at that time Natalee was in the ocean.. I believed she was in Venezuela.
She has never contacted the family ..Nor has she posted her thoughts on the Internet..
She has stayed silent.
I still have her on tape...  and The F.B.I. contacted her before I did..They wanted to know her opinion.. She also told them Natalee was in the ocean..
 Never said she was in a fish/crab trap and has never been contacted for approximate location of where Natalee may have been placed..
 I remember her words about the people involved.. Very dangerous people/ she sensed drug dealers and murders.. Also her words about how far out...Way Out !
 Also her last words.. Before this is over Many Nations will be involved.
It is all on tape... It is dated..
It appears she was correct.. and she always impressed me as honesty without any hesitation ..
Her name, Annette Martin.
I found it very interesting the fbi called her so quickly.. as she has advised them before.

There were other predictions .. Like this one who felt compelled to contact the family.
 http://www.marybrents.com/missing.htm

But Annette has strick rules on this.. I am just amazed at how accurate she was.
I did contact her and gave her a link to the Persistance web site.. I wonder what she thinks of all of this today..

She did say that the body would not be found..
Oh well.

That is pretty interesting.  Would she mind if you uploaded that to YouTube?  I would like to see it. 

[Anna]

So what person had the inside knowledge of the cover-up from beginning to end that could possibly have recorded this?Why would they have put their life at risk unless they were possibly gonna be the fall guy?

I still think it was someone "documenting" the cover-up to ensure the security guards would not be railroaded.

Assuming, of course, the security guards did not agree to be railroaded.  For a price and catch and release deal, of course. 

I know, I know, I am totally cynical after all this time and being jerked around so much.


.

[Anna]

.
Nothing is ever what it seems at first glance.

.

[Anna]

So what person had the inside knowledge of the cover-up from beginning to end that could possibly have recorded this?Why would they have put their life at risk unless they were possibly gonna be the fall guy?

I still think it was someone "documenting" the cover-up to ensure the security guards would not be railroaded.

Or recording the "undoing" of a fabricated crime scene?  Was there a sudden change of plans in the cover up?

[Keepthefaith]

So what person had the inside knowledge of the cover-up from beginning to end that could possibly have recorded this?Why would they have put their life at risk unless they were possibly gonna be the fall guy?

I still think it was someone "documenting" the cover-up to ensure the security guards would not be railroaded.

Assuming, of course, the security guards did not agree to be railroaded.  For a price and catch and release deal, of course. 

I know, I know, I am totally cynical after all this time and being jerked around so much.


.

For me.Who else were Joran and Paulus potentially gonna set-up?I don't know.Just throwing random thoughts out there.The Mansur Family record it for political,as well as personal reasons?Who and why?

[Tamikosmom]

So what person had the inside knowledge of the cover-up from beginning to end that could possibly have recorded this?Why would they have put their life at risk unless they were possibly gonna be the fall guy?

I still think it was someone "documenting" the cover-up to ensure the security guards would not be railroaded.

Assuming, of course, the security guards did not agree to be railroaded.  For a price and catch and release deal, of course. 

I know, I know, I am totally cynical after all this time and being jerked around so much.


.

I do not think that the security guards agreed to anything in regards to their detention.  However I believe that some negotiations took place in regards to what Deepak reveal to him while their detainment overlapped by a a few days.

Think about the implication.  Paulus van der Sloot was involved in the Holiday Inn fabrication prior to Jug and Beth arriving on the Island.

An official witness statement from Mickey John has never surfaced.

Janet

_____

Former Aruba Suspect Alleges Plot!
Wednesday, June 29, 2005

MICKEY JOHN, FORMER SUSPECT: ... He (Deepak) said a story being made up about dropping the girl of at a Holiday Inn, was all something being made up. He, and the Dutch guy, and the Dutch guy's father, they sit and made up the story.

VAN SUSTEREN: The father, too?

JOHN: All of them. They made up...

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he specifically say — Deepak specifically say to you the father was part of that?

JOHN: Deepak told me that he and the family sit down and they made up the story.

VAN SUSTEREN: So family and not father?

JOHN: Well, I don't know who the family consists of. But I know the father was involved, according to him.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161044,00.html